Decimator conversion

So I REALLY like converting models... love it. So much that sometimes I just get caught up in making more and more models and then all of a sudden, I have a ton of models to paint. Well, maybe not suddenly. :-) In the previous post, it was an attempt to look at the kits, most of them great, that GW produces to still use them just modified from their original purpose. This post is no different. This is one of the biggest models I have put together, it was fun, slightly scary, and ate up some bits lying around.

First off let's start with the conversion in question... Forgeworld's Decimator for Chaos.

I love this model, everything about it screams Chaos to me. A big hulking monstrosity that has to have a bigger storage tank for the bigger demon inside.  It's rules are pretty good as well, not over the top, and allows some tactical flexibility in being able to take marks.  All around it's great, and it's threat potential can be outstanding. I will order one eventually. (Ok, I MIGHT order one eventually, throwing things into a cart on FW's site was was over $225 [American] before the shipping for not a whole lot.  So I just have a new found respect for people who collect a lot of FW.) It's just too cool of a model not to. However, I didn't want to wait for a model to arrive to me, so it was time to make one and do a little research to see what I could see.  As it turns out, there isn't a whole lot of Decimator conversions out there.  At least when I was looking there wasn't.  So after looking at FW's size chart I was starting to get an idea for how big this thing needed to be and came to the conclusion of using a Dreadknight as a the starting point.  After the game last Saturday, it turns out that is actually a pretty good size comparison.  My Decimator is taller than my buddie's Contemptor on a scenic resin base, and my Decimator is flat footed on the base too.

So where to start? With the basic construction of course.  Which in this case was the torso and legs. I'll post the pictures I have during the process, which I'll apologize for now as I don't have a whole lot of those.  The first step, get rid of the baby carrier.   This involved clipping and scraping away the platform the GK sits on/is attached to, to leave a cavity for the head to sit in.  On thing I did do, which looking back on now was probably not the best idea, was to glue the torso to the legs early.  This fixed the position, and while that's not bad in itself, it does make the pose more static.  I would like to make another at some point, so things to remember for later.

Once the basic construction was done, how the hell I am supposed to chaosify this thing?! Leftover Heldrake and Forgefiend parts that's how. One you really start looking at the thing you start to see a whole lot of bits from different kits. Whenever possible I tried to use as many bits from the Dreadknight kit as possible, this involved a lot of repurposing certain bits from their original designation. For example, all the hoses that flank either side of the Decimator's head are almost exclusively from the Dreadknight kit. The real huge find in my bits box was the cowling for the battle cannon on a Defiler, it was MADE for that spot around the head. So, a real quick breakdown of kits used/broken for this conversion...

Dreadknight
Heldrake claw and neck
Forgefiend ectoplasma cannon
Chaos vehicle sprue
Imperial vehicle sprue
Defiler battle cannon cowling
Raptor flamer
Necrosphinx head
Possessed spikes
Light from a teleport homer
Demon Prince leg plates and loincloth
Flagellant tethered skulls
Assorted skulls - Vampire counts corpse cart and a ghoul head

Some spare plasticard and greenstuff

All in all I'm pretty happy with the way it turned out.  As of now it is primed and waiting for some proper paint to bring it to life!

Ubiquitous model kits

So, the one thing that I have noticed, along with everyone else, is how much GW is charging for it's plastic crack.  Now the design of these new models may be lacking a bit, but that doesn't mean you can't field a great looking force at a lower price. It just takes some thought and the right kit to make you go "Ahhhhhhh... that's the one!" (This was written before the Demon WD dropped showing some of the new demon models painted WWWWAAAAAAYYYY better than their leaked counterparts.  Is it a matter of the "leaked" pictures being the worst examples? So when we see more versions of those ugly models that the paint job can actually change how we look at them? Anyway...)  On a side note, doing these types of conversion can keep your force tourny legal if they have a minimum of GW parts needed... which to my knowledge was only the GW tournies so maybe it's not an issue anymore?  Please leave comments below if you know the answer to that!


For example, the Tyranid Warrior kit. This kit alone can give you several options from making your standard Warrior, to Hive Guard, Zoanthropes, and even Lictors. Considering those last 3 of that list are Finecast only, the price can add up quickly. Three Zoans are about $75, where as a box of Warriors are $47. To convert the Zoans you just use the left over Mawlock head plates from your Trygons... you do have a few Trygons right? �� A little bit of sprue for some filler, random bits box parts for the base, some green stuff to make the big brain, and there you go. A Zoan with minimal effort, and most of it you already had laying around in bits anyways.

Hive Guard are another example... cut down the venom cannon, put on the rending claws, glue the armor piece to the carapace, and finally the only outside bit you need is a Hormagant head with a horn. Add some green stuff and your finished.

Both of these examples were found from Google searches, and the above is just my interpretation of those examples.  That's also kinda the point, people out there are finding ways to make great looking armies and sharing that information with the world.  Go look, try it out, and say thanks to them when you can.

Another example, Fiends of Slaanesh... I HATE those models. Hate them.  But, I think I found a usable workaround, especially since I'm trying to have some Demon Allies for my CSM. (This has stopped for the moment until I get the new Demon Codex) The Crypt Horror/Vargheist models are about twice the height of a Bloodletter, and fit very well on a 40mm round base. (Added bonus here are the wings from this kit, I'm using a pair to make my Parasite of Mortrex conversion) They too fit the 47:75 price ratio, and while we are at it...isn't $47 kind of an odd price? �� It's a very simple conversion as we're talking the crypt horror heads and arms on the vargheist body. Sorta spiky, and furry, reminiscent of Seekers in structure to a certain extent. In fact the paint job should translate well from Seekers since there are physical attributes that tie those models together as well.

This especially works for me because of all of my Demonettes are now Demons of Slaanesh.  I originally converted them from Bloodletter bodies, arms, and heads with the horns clipped way down/off, and combined that with Demonette claws for the hands.  These were for my generic Lesser Demons from the last CSM codex. I didn't want the recognizable demons for my Lessers so I just had to convert them all... herp, then convert them again to make them still playable... that just involved ripping the old heads off (Khorne would be proud) and replacing them with Ghoul heads... derp.  Too much work?  Probably.  Upside is I have very unique Demon(ette)s that if I wanted another unit if Demonettes I would just use them straight out of the box AND have the benefit of visually telling them apart easily on the battlefield.

Another model I'm starting to find, or at least see, A TON other uses for is the Forgefiend. That ectoplasma cannon head thing is AWESOME. It came in real handy on a chopped down neck for my Heldrake as you can see here.

I have a feeling that the other cannons and any spare parts from this kit will come in handy when I attempt to make a Decimator from a Dreadknight kit. That will be a fun project.

All it takes for any of these is looking around and seeing what can try with what you have, or what can be had at a reasonable price.  The quality of kits coming  out does make this process easier as well.  With the erosion of metal models from GW, and the highly detailed plastic kits coming out... converting unique models from characters to troops has never been easier. In fact most of my inspiration for my Chaos Space Marines is actually coming from the Fantasy side of Warhammer right now, specifically the newer models from the Warriors of Chaos.  They have a baroque feel to them, and are just crying out to be released from the warp.  My converted Abaddon is a good example...

So he's almost completed, just some green stuff and guitar string and he'll be ready for paint.  Now I'm thinking about how to make Typhus, Huron, and Aharmin as well but not from standard space marine parts.

What are some of the things you've seen or even tried yourself?  Share below!!

Chris

2nd Battle with Chaos

So this battle went better, and it was a closer game overall... after consolidating my cultist unit back onto an objective I won the game.  If I didn't do that, I would have lost the game.  I was getting carried away again and starting to forget the objectives... maybe Khorne is gnawing at my soul after all.

This list had multiple threats with fast units and hard hitting long range support.  I ran the list from the last post here, and at 1500 points you start to get an idea of what the Chaos 'Dex is capable of.  Then next gameday is a swap day, I'm getting most of my buddies Chaos stuff and he's getting a few boxes of mine that are just sitting around and collecting dust.  Above all else it felt good, and wasn't frustrating like trying to shoehorn my current models into a current 'Dex when they were designed for the old one.

Some things learned...

Cultists with a Dark Apostle (DA) are amazing, a DA doesn't need anything beyond the Mark of Tzeentch, Spawn are highly annoying (both for myself and my opponent), Bikers are cool but how about more spawn?, auto-cannon Havocs put out a punishing number of shots, AP doesn't have to be an issue if you're putting out enough shots/hits in CC, 'Brutes are good mobile gun platforms, and giving champs and ICs Gift is a great way to start the battle. 2+ save on a Jugger Lord before the battle starts (that was a lucky roll)? Yes please.

Apostle idea stolen inspired by Danny Cyanide over at Bolter & Chainsword

Suffice it to say, I am loving the idea of a horde Chaos Space Marine army.  So much so I just got a lot off of eBay that comprised of 12 chosen, a lord, 10 auto-gun cultists, 10 auto-pistol &  ccw cultists, and a Hellbrute... all from the Dark Vengeance (DV) set. In addition, this lot also contained 5 oop metal Possessed, a Chaos Sorc, 3 bikes (still in boxes), 13 Berserkers, and a spawn. All of that for $40 less than a CSM battleforce.  Add to that my own DV set of Chaos, and that I traded all my Dark Angel models for my buddies Chaos models out of his DV set.  For even further chaos madness, remember that I still have 2 10 man squads of CSM, a 10 man Berserker squad, 5 Termies, a Termie lord, 2 auto/las Predators, 2 converted Oblits, 24 lesser demons (converted), a greater demon (also converted), and I believe a metric ton of spare bits.  I might have just crossed the 3000 point barrier.

Quick, we need 20 more bodies stat!!

Cultists with flamers, converted from Empire Flagellants 

I will have A LOT of painting to do but I also have been considering switching the army to... Black Legion. So that might help with the speed of painting, although with how fast I paint normally, maybe not.  Black, gold, and silver for the general scheme with red accents.  Plus I can use the scheme I developed for my mutants in my now defunct Lost and the Damned army for my cultists, which was black, brown, and silver.  A dark cloud of bodies marching across the field, sowing death and destruction for the Gods by any means necessary.  Painting the force Black Legion will also give me a nice contrast to painting my Tyrainds.  So painting either force shouldn't get to old and at the very least give me the opportunity to bounce back and forth between them when one does get stale from painting.

Some of this is me trying to embrace the new 'Dex to its fullest, by using as many marks and/or icons as possible and not being restrictive in my list building anymore.  Some of this is also feeling like there is no real benefit to running an undivided force without specific marks or icons.  That the aspect of chaos undivided now is to have at least one mark per god in your army... and that is simply not the how I see the Word Bearers.

Simple 'Brute conversion with auto-cannon and missile launcher.

The next game is settled at 1850 points.  My buddy is running 'Wolves so there is a lot that can bring the hurt in his list.  That's ok... like Tyler says "I want you to hit me as hard as you can..."

It will be an interesting battle, especially since I want to bring demons into the mix.  Demonettes to be specific, as of now Slaanesh is the only mark/icon I'm not running so he's up next.  I haven't had a chance to use the Allies Chart yet and the whole prospect sounds exciting.  Deepstriking demons into his line will only add more pressure than I'm already applying.  Tweak some points to make sure I can break open a Land Raider and we have a winner.  Maybe :-)  Next post will deal with the "improved" list and how it performed.

Chris

1st battle with Chaos

So a few weekends ago I had my first battle with the new Chaos 'Dex.  By the end of turn 5, I had an Obliterator and a Rhino left.  I got wasted!  But there a few caveats to this battle...

- It was only 1,000 points

- I was running what I had already built, and basing the points cost on current load outs 

- I was also playing way more aggressively than I would normally (which is probably what cost me the battle)... I didn't really care about the objectives I wanted to see how my current army had changed.

The list was as follows...

A Lord with Termie Armor, combi-plasma, VoTLW, and The Black Mace attached to 5 Terminators with power axes, a heavy flamer, and VoTLW.

10 Marines, MoK, flamer x 2, power sword on the champ, Rhino with Havoc Launcher

10 Marines, MoN, plasma guns x 2, Rhino with Havoc Launcher

2 Spawn with MoN

2 Oblits with MoN

-------------------------------------------

1001 points total 

Now, contrasting this with my Nids, I'm on a new learning curve again.  I mean, I'm actually using vehicles where before I just popping them open.  Before I was running 4-5 T6 Monstrous Creatures(MCs), another 3-6 T6 Hive Guard, 20 Gants, and 3-6 Psykers with Biomancy.  The last version of my Nid list was really shooty and A LOT of T6 critters.  It was hard for my buddy to kill any of them, especially buffed up from Biomancy.  Add the ability to spawn more troops, what's there not to love?

Wow, Chaos has nothing like that.  I got spoiled.  Some sticking points from my first battle.  T5 Chaos Space Marines(CSM) are durable, but not awesome.  CSMs with the Mark of Khorne put out a punishing amount of attacks.  Havoc Launchers on Rhinos aren't worth the points.  Rhinos moving Flat Out are great.  Terminators need a Land Raider to be mobile on the battlefield, Deep Striking and standing there wastes time.  Rolling on the Boon Table is fun, and scary, but having Gift would've helped to buff some characters before the battle started.  One thing that really struck me was the speed of the Spawn, damn are they fast.

So that's that where I kinda want to go, a speedy list... well at least better mobility.  A rough list I'm thinking about is...

Dark Apostle with Mark of Tzeentch (MoT[3++]), the Brand, and Gift.  He'll be "shepherding" 20 Cultists with 2 flamers and another 20 Cultists with Autoguns and 2 flamers

A Lord with Mark of Khorne (MoK), Axe of Blind Fury, Gift, and riding a Jugger.  He's joined by 5 bikes with MoK, Icon of Wrath, Meltagun, and Gift on the champ

10 CSM with MoK, 2 Flamers, Icon of Wrath, Gift on the champ, and a Rhino

Dread with Reaper and Missile Launcher
Dread with Reaper and Missile Launcher

5 Havocs with Autocannons
5 Havocs with Autocannons

3 Spawn with Mark of Nurgle
----------------------------------------------------------

1498 points with a model count of 72.  4 models with Gift rolls.  20 S7 shots and 2 S8 shots per turn at long range.  7 template weapons, one of which is Torrent and AP 3.  Not bad.  A touch light on the antitank.  It might be worth it to drop the Spawn and put some more melta into the list, or at least Missile Launchers... some type of S8 weapon.  But if I drop the Spawn then I lose my screen for the bikes and Lord.  Maybe squeeze some points out and replace the flamers in the CSM squad with meltaguns?

One thing that I noticed from the previous list was there was no target saturation.  I simply didn't have enough threats on the board, or I just didn't have anything my opponent read as  threatening.  This new list feels like I have enough threats to achieve that and some of those threats are FAST.  The idea is that my opponent wont be able to focus on the Lord unit, or the Dark Apostle blob, the Spawn, the CSMs, the Dreads, or the Havocs without something either getting to his line or hammering his line with firepower.

My regular gaming buddy and I usually play anywhere from 1500 to 1850 in points, with a good amount of them at 1750.  We have yet to play a 2000 point game, we are just too slow.  But now I'm kinda getting excited by having vehicles... or even Allies for that matter.  You know... the stuff I didn't have to worry about too much with my Nids.  Next game is this Saturday(11/24), I'll keep you posted with what worked and what was an utter failure.

Chris

Well then...

Codex: Chaos Space Marines has hit and there was an overwhelming... silence?  Don't get me wrong, I have seen all sorts of things from "OMG 'tis da bestes!!1! to "Meh".  Which makes me think... did Mr. Kelly actually get it wrong?  Could it be the ball was dropped?  That the real thing didn't live up to the hype at all?  Maybe.  It could also be that there were SO MANY rumors going around that maybe we suspended all disbelief of any type of failure...

Screw it.  It's here now and no use crying over what it could've/should've been.  Really?  We have been living with what will now forever be known as "The Gav 'Dex", it will live on long afterwards much like 3.5 did only without the nostalgia and warm fuzzy feelings.  Does the current codex get he "just right" stamp?  It's not too cold like the Gav 'Dex, but it also isn't too hot like the Haines(3.5) 'Dex either.

There are blogs aplenty that have done their unit by unit breakdown, I am not going to do that.  I am greedy with my time and only really care about how this affects my Word Bearers, and how this might change them (but ultimately how does it change my CURRENT models... ) or turn me off entirely to work solely on my 'Nids.  Chaos, it seems, is indeed fickle.

The HQs I have played around with have always been counts as Dark Apostles in the form of Lords, and/or Sorcerers... sometimes in Termie armor, sometimes with an Personal Icon, and sometimes as a vessel for a Greater Demon.  Now I actually have a Dark Apostle to use and, so far, he's kind of a mixed bag for me.  The design standpoint of Chaos right now seems to be Marks of Chaos everywhere, and to get a truly Undivided force you would have to take at least one marked unit from each power.  My inner fluff bunny is dying as I type.

That aside, a Dark Apostle with the Mark of Tzeentch is going to be a tough nut to crack with a 3+/3++ save.  Now the load-out has varied.  The Black Mace, maybe The Brand of Skalathrax, or nothing... but what about The Dimensional Key?  You don't lose any weapons taking the Key, and all friendly units don't scatter after it's activated.  Now, depending on how the 'Dex gets FAQed (and it will need it) this can become the new Demon Bomb if "friendly" includes allied Demons AND the Key works table wide.  At the moment it can be read as an additional effect of the Key's 12" aura or table wide.  But, how to get him into close combat as quickly as possible to activate the Key as fast as possible is the trick... put him with 4 Termies in a Land Raider? 9 Possessed in a Land Raider from heavy support?  With no option for a bike or wings he's kinda stuck hitching a ride with someone else and a Land Raider seems like the most reliable way to get him there.  He could have at least had the option for a demonic steed, a la Jarulek on a Disk.  So, a basic load-out I would do would be as follows...

Dark Apostle with 

Mark of Tzeentch

Gift of Mutation

The Dimensional Key

------------------

155 pts

Not bad, but if I can turn him in to a table wide Icon/Teleport homer that allied demons can use then it's worth it.

My Troops choices have always been the basic Chaos Space Marine, again Undivided here.  Last 'Dex I was fielding 2 squads of 10 with either Plasma Guns or Flamers, with a Power Fist champ, Icon of Chaos Glory, in a Rhino with a Havoc Launcher.  That clocks in at ~275ish points.  But, you got an all-comer unit with a 3+ save, S8 can opener, and a moving wall.  The unit as a whole was tough and less likely to shift because of the Icon, Morale re-rolls are awesome, and I will miss them.  The Icon also served as a delivery system for my other Troops, Summoned Lesser Demons, which I ran in 3 squads of 8 and they were stupid cheap for what you got.  A marine stat line, with a built in invulnerable save, AND they could assault when they showed up.  A rare, and powerful ability these days in 6th and I can see Ymgarls losing this as well when Nids get their turn.

So how does a basic CSM squad cost with a similar load-out today?

9 CSM + Champ

2 Plasma Guns

Gift of Mutation

----The total to this point is 180----

If I wanted to keep this unit really cheap, I would just add a power fist to the champ and footslog them at 205 points.  

Chaos Stars on Tumblr

Now where it gets interesting is whether you take an Icon of Vengeance, and make the unit Fearless... which Fearless in 6th is great, just ask any Nid player OR you give them Veterans of the Long War (VotLW) which gives them Hatred(Space Marines).  Going with the former is about 15 points more expensive than the latter.  Then add a Rhino with a Havoc Launcher and you get a range of 237 - 252 points that gives you lots of mobile firepower, with a decent save.  

I didn't take the close combat weapons for the squad or a power fist for the champ.  I'm trying to keep the unit on the cheap(er) side and both those options would add another 43 points to the unit.  I would rather spend those points on something else.  This, I think, is the downside of the new 'Dex.  Making sure that you have your Swiss Army unit is expensive with so many options to choose.  So just for the requisite 1 HQ and 2 Troops I am spending 629 points, ~1/3 of an 1850 list, or 565 without the Rhinos... which, by the way, feels a hell of a lot better.

So this has been a rough breakdown of the current Chaos 'Dex with the models I already own, and how those models have changed in their roles.  If I have to redo a good portion of my army I won't be terribly happy about it.  Getting some games in will definitely help me make up my mind, but Hive Guard have spoiled me something fierce.